Formula 1

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Postby robbo » 02 Oct 2016, 17:13

Johnmcl7 wrote:Mercedes changed Hamilton’s power unit three times to stock up on parts for the remainder of this season.


Well, that
Spoiler:
didn't
work well for him today!
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Postby Johnmcl7 » 02 Oct 2016, 21:00

Spoiler:
The stockpiling is so he doesn't get another penalty for using another engine, if they'd done it normally they'd have taken a single penalty and got a single engine out of it so this one blowing would have results in further penalties. However as they have still I think another two he doesn't get another penalty although that seems little consolation, it looks like he's going to lose the championship because for some reason he's had the most engine failures of any of the Mercedes engines including the customer ones.
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Postby robbo » 02 Oct 2016, 23:47

Spoiler:
I understand why they took the imaginary hit with the stockpiling. What I was getting at was that it was a new part that failed - if they had kept it the same like in Rosberg's car then maybe he wouldn't have had an engine failure (at this race). Who knows, it might have gone anyway.

I was losing interest in the race until I saw flames. Was actually typing on the TP:L and missed when it initially happened.
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Postby Tappy » 03 Oct 2016, 10:03

Perhaps they could just get rid of the limit on engines. Apparently engine costs now are more than they were in the past (no idea if inflation is in there!) It seems that the cost saving of using fewer engines is outweighed by the cost of making durable engines. I also loved the random engine failures back in the day.
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Postby Replicant » 03 Oct 2016, 13:51

Any truth in the fact that only 1 driver out of all the teams supplied by Mercedes has suffered a blown engine this year?
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Postby Johnmcl7 » 04 Oct 2016, 01:18

Replicant wrote:Source of the post Any truth in the fact that only 1 driver out of all the teams supplied by Mercedes has suffered a blown engine this year?


I didn't realise it was quite as bad as that but earlier in the season before this failure, Hamilton's engines had the worst reliability of any Mercedes engine including the customer ones.
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Postby Replicant » 04 Oct 2016, 12:35

8 drivers over four teams totalling 43 engines so far and only Hamilton has had an engine blow up is what was being quoted. 3 of his engines I think.
Probably coincidental but I can see why he pondered the question.

I haven't looked into it fully but it makes a great conspiracy theory that a German team want a German driver to win the championship.
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Postby robbo » 04 Oct 2016, 23:07

Tappy wrote: Perhaps they could just get rid of the limit on engines.


DC was saying something along those lines in his commentary. A graphic came up showing how many engine parts Hamilton had used and it was along the lines of "this doesn't interest me at all and shouldn't be what F1 is about".

As for the conspiracy theories... Some say it's Hammie's driving style but I'm guessing bad luck and an appearance of sabotage which is probably just coincidence. To sabotage an engine and make it blow up in flames at your main sponsor's home race doesn't sound like a good idea/plausible.
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Postby Johnmcl7 » 05 Oct 2016, 02:03

Replicant wrote:Source of the post 8 drivers over four teams totalling 43 engines so far and only Hamilton has had an engine blow up is what was being quoted. 3 of his engines I think.
Probably coincidental but I can see why he pondered the question.

I haven't looked into it fully but it makes a great conspiracy theory that a German team want a German driver to win the championship.


I can easily see why Hamilton was annoyed and sounding off but I just can't see that Mercedes would be sabotaging his car in such a subtle manner, it would be too difficult to do it that way and keep most of the team in the dark. Also I don't think Mercedes are that bothered about having a German driver win the championship, I don't think it's any benefit to the brand and particularly when Hamilton is generally a lot more popular than Rosberg as I'm not aware of Hamilton getting as much booing as Rosberg has had. Also although Merc are German and some of its top management are as well, the team is predominantly British.

The only way I could see Hamilton pushing his engine harder than others if he was running the engine longer in a higher engine mode than he was supposed to but Mercedes have detailed data on this and they'd know if he was.

With regards to engine limits I think it's a difficult one to call as I can see what they're trying to achieve as I remember the days when they had engines purely for qualifying and it was all a bit over the top. At the same though I think it's a shame to see drivers penalised multiple times for an engine fail when it's not their fault, you seem the same in other motorsports as well but never a good way to deal with it.

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Postby matt » 05 Oct 2016, 08:32

guess that's the difference between a great racer and championship winner, those that normally win have had to put in the special performances consistently to overcome the DNF's due to mechanical failures or "maldonadoesque" racing incidents.

You'll know for sure I'm not a hamfan so for me if he loses this championship, I won't be upset as I'd hope it would give him a reality check. Deep down though I respect what he can do in a car, it's just when he opens his mouth / twitter, it makes me hamgry!
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Postby Tappy » 05 Oct 2016, 09:51

Johnmcl7 wrote:I can easily see why Hamilton was annoyed and sounding off but I just can't see that Mercedes would be sabotaging his car in such a subtle manner, it would be too difficult to do it that way and keep most of the team in the dark. Also I don't think Mercedes are that bothered about having a German driver win the championship(...)


+1.

It's daft to think a team would purposely hamper their own championship because one of their drivers is a different nationality to the team or sits higher on the arse scale of every-racing-driver-is-an-arse. In fact, being a different nationality provides more TV time as they need to play two anthems! I suppose if his attitude carries on to the pit garage, his engineers might not put in the care that Rosberg's engineers do. Or it's just one of those things - like Rosberg and his steering wheel issues last year.
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Postby robbo » 05 Oct 2016, 14:40

Tappy wrote:Source of the post his engineers might not put in the care that Rosberg's engineers do


They swapped engineers this year. Rosberg has Hammie's from last year and Hammie Rosberg's. So that doesn't work. Or does it...? Hammie to Rosberg: No but then yes if they did a great job with H last year... Rosberg to Hammie: Yes if they weren't too good last year and now cba with H this year... Hmmm, all unlikely but more conspiracies!
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Postby Tappy » 05 Oct 2016, 15:04

robbo wrote:Source of the post
Tappy wrote:Source of the post his engineers might not put in the care that Rosberg's engineers do


They swapped engineers this year. Rosberg has Hammie's from last year and Hammie Rosberg's. So that doesn't work. Or does it...? Hammie to Rosberg: No but then yes if they did a great job with H last year... Rosberg to Hammie: Yes if they weren't too good last year and now cba with H this year... Hmmm, all unlikely but more conspiracies!


Oh, I didn't realise that. Hmmm, maybe this does have weight after all. Nothing more demoralizing than doing the same job but in worse conditions.
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Postby Johnmcl7 » 05 Oct 2016, 19:31

matt wrote:Source of the post guess that's the difference between a great racer and championship winner, those that normally win have had to put in the special performances consistently to overcome the DNF's due to mechanical failures or "maldonadoesque" racing incidents.


Regardless of how much I dislike how he behaves off the track, I thought this season he's put in quite a performance to overcome all that he lost at the start of the year due to mechanical failure and now it looks like he's going to lose it anyway. Of course it's also unfair that pretty much any driver other than Rosberg or Hamilton has no chance at all at the championship.
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Postby Tappy » 06 Oct 2016, 09:52

I think Hammy did suffer a bit with the technical side of things when 'driver coaching' was banned. There are some races he could have got a better position if he'd up to speed with how the settings work.
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